Mecca

I'm going to visit Mecca as a white non-muslim. From what I understand you aren't allowed in if you aren't Muslim. If I grow a a bushy beard and learn some quaran verses can I sneak into Stink Rock city and touch Le Cube?

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  1. 3 months ago
    fuck off larper

    No, if you're white they'll ask for someone from the islamic community to corroborate your conversion.

    Unless you're really good friends with your local islamic imam who'll do the paperwork for you, you won't get in.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      That's not hard to fake lmao.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        You realize that the punishment for apostasy in these countries is death, right? Why the frick would you risk being found out when you will literally be beheaded for it?

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      Meanwhile Muslims are allowed to freely roam and desecrate any Christian holy site they want.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        Meanwhile morons like you will believe anything they read

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Meanwhile Muslims are allowed to freely roam and desecrate any Christian holy site they want.
        That's on Christians for being unserious pussies.

        • 3 months ago
          Anonymous

          turn the other cheek

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        Christ rejects iconography, It's not sinful, it's not blasphemous, but Christians only need their own free will to worship. No icons, not even structured worship required, just trust and faith in Christ.
        >not trying to proselytize, not even religious

        • 3 months ago
          Cult of Passion

          Idk, Ive been all over the world and the different ways they honored this or that is only difference in the 7-11 and delivery auto-wieners.

          He made a statue of his dog, pretty crappy one too.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Meanwhile Muslims are allowed to freely roam and desecrate any Christian holy site they want.
        You can "roam" to any mosque i know. But you neither can access the inner of Vatican city, Cape Canaveral outside tourist way
        or even the machine halls in Disneyland/world regardless of your religion. So what?

  2. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    To visit Mecca and Medina as a foreigner you need a special hajj visa arranged by an authorised hajj tour agency. If you can’t convince them that you’re Muslim (do you speak Arabic and know what a Hadith is?) they won’t help you. There are plenty of legit hajjis.

    Do not frick around with Saudi visa requirements. Punishments are extreme especially if the religion is involved.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      See and go frick yourself btw

      Meanwhile Muslims are allowed to freely roam and desecrate any Christian holy site they want.

      I mean, it's up to the clergy to forbid access to non-christians. Why don't they decide that ?
      Also tons of countries already descrated their churches by having a fee to pay to enter them

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        >go frick yourself btw
        Imagine getting mad about your special rock
        shut up brainlet

        • 3 months ago
          Anonymous

          Not mad, and it's not about the place itself. I just have no respect for SighSeelers that want to bypass sacred sites just for hubris, to say that they fooled everyone

          • 3 months ago
            Anonymous

            >This part of earth is OUR special sacred site you can't come cuz ur different lol
            You are mad, and you are a brainlet. Don't respond to me you're the weakest link

            • 3 months ago
              Anonymous

              Lol you have no concept of what sacred or holy means let alone private, even the notion of respect for a place that is not meant to be touristic is alien to you. You're plain moronic

              >Why don't they decide that ?
              Because we're a more advanced civilization than you are.

              Not part of their civilization. And since when keeping some places dedicated to religion only for that purpose a sign of backwardness ?

              • 3 months ago
                Anonymous

                Funny how you talk about protecting your special little cube whilst invading every other cultures "sacred", "private" places. You're an ignorant shit, no surprises there.

              • 3 months ago
                Anonymous

                Why are you still wasting time shitposting here when you have imams to impersonate and conversion documents to forge? Your epic hoax isn’t going to carry itself out, no matter how easy it is.

                Get busy and don’t come back until it’s to post a selfie in front of the Abrāj al-Bayt.

                Don’t forget to learn how to pray.

              • 3 months ago
                Anonymous

                >"sacred"
                >"private"
                Not him, but the Vatican is free and open. They made it so. Were it only for christians, i would not have visited the place. Hell, most muslims barely want to go inside a church.
                But I know what your mean, and your sister's private isnt private when she literally gave me a blowjob, white boy.

              • 3 months ago
                Anonymous

                Whatever the group you have in mind, I'm not part of them, sorry to break it to you. Also, I'm advocating for more respect towards holy sites. If they're already extremly busy with pilgrims, close them to tourists, as simple as that. The amount of unbelievers that want to hike to Santiago de Compostela just for fun and giggles should maybe make them consider closing the site to non-christians, considering the shitshow it can create on arrival

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                >I'm advocating for more respect towards holy sites.
                Not that anon, but lemme stop you right here. "Holy" is a fiction and a spook. Basic emadunication should've already taught you this, if not please request a refund from your public school system. I'm going to pretend the meteorite cube is holy just as that guy is a female, i.e. not at all. He's a dude in a dress, and that meteorite cube is a nice odditiy that's meant for the world to be enjoyed. Either that or Europe brings back the spiked borders and cattle trains, and you wouldn't like that, so open wide.
                >make them consider closing the site to non-christians
                What about not the RIGHT TYPE of christians? That regressive mudcult has already been there Anon, don't excuse it for doing it again.

          • 3 months ago
            Anonymous

            >Why don't they decide that ?
            Because we're a more advanced civilization than you are.

            Do you really think the authorities care this much ? Kek.
            The truth is, they've got everything to gain by putting this restriction. If you're curious and you want to make your trip there safe, you WILL have to do a minimal amount of research on Islam, and then have to larp as a muslim for a few days to see how it feels. Worst case, you come back having spent a lot of money in that giant fricking 7-11 of a city and paid a nice visa fee. Middle case, you just come back a bit more humbled because you see people caring about something you've probably paid no mind before, be it religion in general or just one as alien as Islam. At best, you come back from a spiritual experience that turns you into them.

            Also, pragmatically speaking, Saudis follow that "non muslim" discrimination command because it's still economically viable. They can afford to tell you to frick off because the 1.8 pajeets are already paying for the full experience.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            why do you give a frick, you homosexual

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Why don't they decide that ?
        Because we're a more advanced civilization than you are.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        Lots of infidels have touched your shit rock homosexual

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      What if someone just goes to Mecca when there's no hajj going on? There are some checkpoints at city's borders? How do they check if someone's muslim or not?

      Also there are millions of visitors during the hajj. I can't imagine they are making some strict control over who is going in that time. Sneaking in, wearing some white towel shouldn't be hard, right?

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        >What if someone just goes to Mecca when there's no hajj going on?
        That's actually called Umrah, a pilgrimage to Mecca outside of the Hajj season. So it's still limited to Muslims. I guess extra devout Muslims do both.
        >There are some checkpoints at city's borders?
        Yes, on the highway.
        To be fair they don't check if you're Muslim so much as if your visa and documents are in order for where you want to go.
        >But that sounds tedious and inefficient.
        Welcome to Saudi.
        >Also there are millions of visitors during the hajj. I can't imagine they are making some strict control over who is going in that time.
        This is all this country actually does. All the rest of their economy is foreign labor.
        I feel like you're much more likely to get away with visiting if you're from a country with an Islamic majority but not Muslimm. So if you're Malaysian maybe? good luck as a white guy.

        • 3 months ago
          Anonymous

          >Good luck as a white guy.
          White but with hazel eyes and brown beard. I know some European Tatars who look more white than me. With some tan I could pass as a Bosnian or something.

          If you don't interact with the authorities, you'll be fine of course. But if you make a misstep and attract suspicion, you will be interrogated, and chances are you will reveal your ignorance of the basic tenets of Islam. Also, if you DO sneak into Mecca and get out, don't be like that fool who uploaded it to YouTube to brag about it...then returned to Saudi Arabia to get arrested and charged. What a fricking moron.

          >reveal your ignorance of the basic tenets of Islam
          As long as I don't have to recite shahada or something in Arabic, I think I'm capable to preper theoretical background for such operation. However from my understanding without a visa that lets me be in Mecca, I'm screwed anyway if I get caught? And for that visa I must bribe some imam to give me some certificate that I'm a muslim?

          Lots of effort to see some cube and a clocktower.

          • 3 months ago
            Anonymous

            there was a Russian guy who did this by getting a conversion certificate from a mosque, you should read his report carefully
            he got it be reciting shahada before a mufti and didn't even have to pay
            https://www.andrewmarcus.ru/travel/mecca-part-1
            officials did not question him about islam, but there were occasionally other pilgrims who suspected something was off, he just walked away though
            afaik the normal penalty for getting caught is deportation and a lifetime ban but they might decide to make an example of you

            • 3 months ago
              Anonymous

              this russian [...] did it with minimal issues and documented the whole trip
              it's more dangerous than nk because you can get caught or have your documents stolen (lots of pickpockets in mecca) but not that difficult to get in
              just have a conversion certificate from a mosque and wear the pilgrim uniform simple as

              Cant read slavrunes

              • 3 months ago
                Anonymous

                There's a google translator build into google chrome that does all the job for you.

          • 3 months ago
            Anonymous

            also I would do it like this
            >when muslims ask where you're from, say you're American (the truth) and either that you converted or that your parents/grandparents are Bosnian/Albanian/Tatar/whatever immigrants, but didn't teach you the language
            >if you have a gf, the easiest way is to say that she's muslim and you converted to marry her
            >do learn the shahada and prayer in Arabic, you don't have to learn anything else (most non-Arab muslims only know these)

          • 3 months ago
            Anonymous

            >However from my understanding without a visa that lets me be in Mecca, I'm screwed anyway if I get caught?
            This is correct—you need either a Hajj or an Umrah visa to get into Mecca, both available to Muslims only. But “getting caught” without one would most likely take place at one of the checkpoints after the highway exits that head towards Mecca (which start ~50km outside the city itself, a long way from the closed zone), rather than anywhere near the cube itself. If people get stopped at these it’s common just to be told to turn around and drive back the other way. I guess people drive towards Mecca by accident, with no deceitful intent, at least occasionally.

            You’re more likely to face arrest and a big fine and deportation, and potentially worse, if they catch you after you’re already in the forbidden city. There are both fixed police checkpoints all over the place and officers walking around on foot in the crowds who can demand to see your papers. If you’re not dressed or behaving appropriately, they will spot you from a great distance.

            An Iraqi Kurdish friend of mine, officially a Muslim by default and thus allowed easy access to the city, but in practice a bourgeois, totally secular, probable atheist who lives in Paris, DJs, and takes a lot of drugs, got stopped and questioned several times both in Mecca and Medina because he just didn’t look right—his clothing and bearing stuck out. Important to note that he wasn’t at either city’s big holy tightly-restricted mosque, where pilgrims wear minor variations on a specific costume, when he was stopped. They wouldn’t have let him anywhere near the Kaaba in his stupid daily wear. But even elsewhere in the cities he didn’t read as a believer and attracted too much attention. In his case, the Iraqi passport and his Arabic were enough to get him off the hook with minimal questions asked. But someone who isn’t an obvious/default Muslim could be in for more invasive questions.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >wants to LARP as a Muslim in one of the most Muslim countries in the world
            >doesn't even know the shahada
            You're unironically going to get killed.

            [...]
            Do you really think the authorities care this much ? Kek.
            The truth is, they've got everything to gain by putting this restriction. If you're curious and you want to make your trip there safe, you WILL have to do a minimal amount of research on Islam, and then have to larp as a muslim for a few days to see how it feels. Worst case, you come back having spent a lot of money in that giant fricking 7-11 of a city and paid a nice visa fee. Middle case, you just come back a bit more humbled because you see people caring about something you've probably paid no mind before, be it religion in general or just one as alien as Islam. At best, you come back from a spiritual experience that turns you into them.

            Also, pragmatically speaking, Saudis follow that "non muslim" discrimination command because it's still economically viable. They can afford to tell you to frick off because the 1.8 pajeets are already paying for the full experience.

            No, the Quran explicitly bans all non-Muslims from entering Mecca. It's actually really important for pragmatic reasons as well, since Mecca gets so overcrowded during parts of Hajj that Muslims have literally breathed all the air out of certain rooms and suffocated.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        If you don't interact with the authorities, you'll be fine of course. But if you make a misstep and attract suspicion, you will be interrogated, and chances are you will reveal your ignorance of the basic tenets of Islam. Also, if you DO sneak into Mecca and get out, don't be like that fool who uploaded it to YouTube to brag about it...then returned to Saudi Arabia to get arrested and charged. What a fricking moron.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        Mecca's still very active outside of the Hajj period and especially during Ramadan. Avoid both periods since Hajj is basically a giant stampede spanning 10 miles and Ramadan, well... the simple act of sipping water would give you away. And it's also a dick move since it's a fricking desert and everybody's fricking thirsty.
        >How do they check if someone's muslim or not?
        There are a few things you have to understand about Islam first and foremost, especially about Mecca itself. Muslims are judged through their good deeds (including but not limited to acts of worship) and their sins. Mecca acts as a multiplier, as much as in the negatives as in the positives. In other words, you don't go to Mecca to frick around. You focus on prayer, religious contemplation, and anything else really is considered a waste of time. You're here to rack up good boy points, not put yourself in situations where you're missing them and you're certainly not trying to sin. Also, the trip is super expensive for most of the world. Islam doesn't allow borrowing money for Hajj or a smaller pilgrimage. The shops and stalls are nice to visit but haggling souvenirs can be done in Djaddah.

        Here's an example :
        picrel alone won't land you in trouble, but praying with cargo shorts above the knee will not only raise a few eyebrows, people will find that a grown man who didn't know this basic tenet of prayer probably doesn't know shit about islam... So what the frick is he doing in here ? People are supposed to train themselves before going or to have at least some kind of handler to avoid gross mistakes like these. A cop would raise an eyebrow too. And don't forget the cherry on top : you're white.

        Same shit if you've got a clean shaved face, wearing neck israeliteelry, etc. In other words, wear a qamis, keep your beard at least a week before, and if you've noticed women not praying, they're on their period and probably came in not alone. That Muslimussy can be found in Djaddah anyway.

        • 3 months ago
          Anonymous

          >That Muslimussy can be found in Djaddah anyway.
          What do you mean, are girls very open-minded there?

          • 3 months ago
            Anonymous

            Jedda is supposed to be the California of Saudi Arabia both in attitudes and climate but it's still Saudi Arabia.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      I overlooked this post. It gave me a fricking stroke.
      >To visit Mecca and Medina as a foreigner you need a special hajj visa arranged by an authorised hajj tour agency.
      Not true since 2019
      > If you can’t convince them that you’re Muslim
      I guess many people as well as I have adressed this
      >do you speak Arabic
      MSA is spoken by 300 million people. There are 1.8 billion muslims in the world, the crushing majority of them (West Africa, SEA, Turkey) not arabs. The only thing you need arabic for is the few verses of quran you'll learn to pass, and there are a shit ton of phonetic guides as well as audio ones out there. I'll be happy to provide OP with any.
      >do you know what a hadith is
      You don't need to know what a hadith is to be a muslim. The Shahadah and the Salah (prayer) are the most important ones that need to be worked out a little (see my post above). The Islam wikipedia page should give you everything else you need.
      >There are plenty of legit hajjis.
      Nothing to do with anything.

      >Do not frick around with Saudi visa requirements. Punishments are extreme especially if the religion is involved.
      Unless you're literally livestreaming yourself jacking off in the women's section of the mosque or trying to throw shit at the cube you should be fine.
      Pretty sure you'd still be fine regardless as long as you don't criticize the government. No one will punish you because you're an overly eager convert who just wanted to see what it's all about.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      I was literally just in medina in a swimsuit and flip flops at le mosque of le prophet momad .. zero issues except for glares

  3. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    Denying Christ to pretend to be a follower of the religion of Satan just to see a stupid rock will land you an eternity in hell.

  4. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    I think your idea is badass and i would love to hear about how it went after , please post here again .

    I think you can get away with it with some real practice . Put some real effort into it and try learning about Islam for a few months . Not only will you pass , but it will probably make the experience a lot better .

    Lastly , in my opinion nobody really knows what’s up there . Most likely God is real and none of the religions man thought of are 100% accurate , but rather just different faces for the same very mysterious concept , good and evil , which side are you on ?

    Go , have fun , good luck , tell us about it

  5. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    >muslims want you to believe allah is real and everyone should be muslim
    >but only if youre arab
    lol, at least christianity is inclusive

  6. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    You wont like this answer, but the easiest way to see the cube is to be a good goy and pay for a tour, I would say try to get a country with the right combo of secularism/poorness so they will play along with your "conversion" or even help you get the papers. Turkey, Central Asia or Bangladesh come to mind

    But of course you wanna roleplay as Richard Burton lmao. Good luck

  7. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    lol no, first, on what visa will you be arriving ?
    you need a special visa for hajj, is not just a mall you can walk thru

    you will stand up like a firecracker at night

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      the expression is "stand out" not stand up

  8. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    So this is more dangerous and way more of a trouble to do than going to north korea? What the frick

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      NK is “easy”. Pay your money, submit to the tour agency, don’t do anything moronic like disrespect the statues

      The Muslim only parts of Saudi are the same, with trying to get in as an unbeliever being a moronic thing. If you’re lucky they’ll just deport you. If you’ve done anything profane without realising it you’re fricked

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      this russian

      there was a Russian guy who did this by getting a conversion certificate from a mosque, you should read his report carefully
      he got it be reciting shahada before a mufti and didn't even have to pay
      https://www.andrewmarcus.ru/travel/mecca-part-1
      officials did not question him about islam, but there were occasionally other pilgrims who suspected something was off, he just walked away though
      afaik the normal penalty for getting caught is deportation and a lifetime ban but they might decide to make an example of you

      did it with minimal issues and documented the whole trip
      it's more dangerous than nk because you can get caught or have your documents stolen (lots of pickpockets in mecca) but not that difficult to get in
      just have a conversion certificate from a mosque and wear the pilgrim uniform simple as

  9. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    WTF this city looks like some shit the Chinese would build.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      >WTF this city looks like some shit the Chinese would build.
      That complex was proudly built by the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia’s own Bin Laden Co., one of the biggest names in Middle Eastern construction and engineering.

      Best-known son of the family got famous for his achievements in other fields, obviously.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        lmao yeah that shit cracked me up when I saw the employees tags the first time. But ever since that crane incident they basically lost that contract and were "nationalized".

        there was a Russian guy who did this by getting a conversion certificate from a mosque, you should read his report carefully
        he got it be reciting shahada before a mufti and didn't even have to pay
        https://www.andrewmarcus.ru/travel/mecca-part-1
        officials did not question him about islam, but there were occasionally other pilgrims who suspected something was off, he just walked away though
        afaik the normal penalty for getting caught is deportation and a lifetime ban but they might decide to make an example of you

        Like I said, a conversion certificate isn't really hard to obtain, since Islam literally allows everybody and anybody in so long as they recite the Shahada. Muslimhood is based on the good faith assumption that if you said it, you're it. They could see you drinking booze the next day right in front of the mosque and they couldn't call you an unbeliever unless you specifically called yourself one.
        >but there were occasionally other pilgrims who suspected something was off, he just walked away though
        If you're wearing cargo shorts with a pink polo or any kind of overly western shit people will literally have no doubt as to the fact that you're not muslim, which I bet was his case.

        this russian [...] did it with minimal issues and documented the whole trip
        it's more dangerous than nk because you can get caught or have your documents stolen (lots of pickpockets in mecca) but not that difficult to get in
        just have a conversion certificate from a mosque and wear the pilgrim uniform simple as

        >it's more dangerous than nk because you can get caught or have your documents stolen (lots of pickpockets in mecca) but not that difficult to get in
        Yeah but then any third world country is "dangerous" for that matter. That's basic travel shit, you keep your travel documents somewhere safe and only show pictures if need be.
        >pilgrim uniform
        The pilgrim uniform is something you should only wear in your trip from djedda to mecca (the one with the two giant towels). When you arrive, just go to your hotel room and wear a qamis. It's a common gown in the muslim world with many variations. Just buy one or two your size in Djedda.

        They also make for great pajamas when you go back home. My ex would wear mine for sheer convenience sometimes lol.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      its the 4th tallest building in the world too

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        Funny how the muslims holiest of holies is dominated by what is not even the top 3 monuments to capitalism.

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        I swear that fricking place looks like mordor
        even before the tower

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        https://i.imgur.com/L58wfHG.jpg

        WTF this city looks like some shit the Chinese would build.

        Funny how the muslims holiest of holies is dominated by what is not even the top 3 monuments to capitalism.

        the Saudis destroyed pretty much anything historical, the city is basically just the mosque and hotels/businesses. There's obviously no cooming happening and from the sound of the thread it's not like anyone here is actually interested in the religion. I really don't understand why you would want to go.
        At least NK has the dystopian mystique.
        I bet Medina would probably be easier to explore and the Prophet's mosque at least has his tomb there. Probably some Ottoman era libraries but I wouldn't know, always wanted to go but never went.

        They destroyed an intact and perfectly preserved 18th century Ottoman Castle to build that moronic mega-hotel
        I hate Saudis so much

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Yeah the Saudis are pure evil. Destroyed all ancient remnants that remained of the first muslims.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >The Venetian Las Vegas if it was built by Muslims instead of israelites

  10. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    test

  11. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    >desert religion
    >most important holiday is where you don't drink water during the day

    Ok.

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      This is intentional.
      The people who realize this is bullshit are the same people who are smart enough to realize the sultan is a fricking moron and there's more of us so lets just kill the bastard.

  12. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    you need to be 18 or older to post here, kid

  13. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    the Saudis destroyed pretty much anything historical, the city is basically just the mosque and hotels/businesses. There's obviously no cooming happening and from the sound of the thread it's not like anyone here is actually interested in the religion. I really don't understand why you would want to go.
    At least NK has the dystopian mystique.
    I bet Medina would probably be easier to explore and the Prophet's mosque at least has his tomb there. Probably some Ottoman era libraries but I wouldn't know, always wanted to go but never went.

  14. 3 months ago
    Anonymous

    OP's gonna get himself killed why no one is stopping him holy shit

    • 3 months ago
      Anonymous

      this isnt the middle ages, hes just gonna get deported lmao

      • 3 months ago
        Anonymous

        ya for us it isnt but for them the holy war never ended

        op is gonna learn the hard way

  15. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    So much speculation in this thread. I have been in Mecca a year ago, let me give you some info:
    - You only need a special visa for hajj time. The remaining 11 months of the year, you can perform umrah, and the standard Saudi tourist e-visa is enough for that.
    - Islam itself does not forbid visiting Mecca to non-Muslims. There are different legal schools in Islam, and the Hanafi school considers it okay to visit Mecca for anyone. Only Saudi Arabia's law technically forbid it, and the penalty is deportation, not death or imprisonment.
    - I went from Jeddah to Mecca by public bus (SAPTCO), nobody checked any documents on entry.
    - When you are inside, there are no checkpoints or anything. And there are thousands of people from all over the world, you won't really stand out there no matter what race you belong to.

  16. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I really just want to try Saudi fried chicken, heard it's the best in the world.

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